I’ve been asked to clarify which side of the family is related to the Haddon Hall folks. The answer is Spriggs, my mother’s side. Lady Ursula Fisher Webb was her first cousin. Through her we are related to the Fishers. And the Fishers had a habit of marrying ‘well.’ About 1510 William Fisher married Mary Vernon of Haddon Hall, a very influential family of the day. Her father, our 14th grandfather, was Sir Henry Vernon, Chief Council of the Prince of Wales, Arthur Tudor.
[Aside:
Arthur Tudor (19/20 September 1486 – 2 April 1502) was Prince of Wales, Earl of Chester and Duke of Cornwall. As the eldest son and heir apparent of Henry VII of England, Arthur was viewed by contemporaries as the great hope of the newly established House of Tudor. His mother, Elizabeth of York, was the daughter of Edward IV, and his birth cemented the union between the House of Tudor and the House of York.
Plans for Arthur’s marriage began before his third birthday; he was installed as Prince of Wales two years later. At the age of eleven, he was formally betrothed to Catherine of Aragon, a daughter of the powerful Catholic Monarchs in Spain, in an effort to forge an Anglo-Spanish alliance against France. Arthur was well educated and, contrary to some modern belief, was in good health for the majority of his life. Soon after his marriage to Catherine in 1501, the couple took up residence at Ludlow Castle in Shropshire, where Arthur died six months later of an unknown ailment. Catherine would later firmly state that the marriage had not been consummated.
One year after Arthur’s death, Henry VII renewed his efforts of sealing a marital alliance with Spain by arranging for Catherine to marry Arthur’s younger brother Henry, who had by then become Prince of Wales. Arthur’s untimely death paved the way for Henry’s accession as Henry VIII in 1509. The potential for a question as to the consummation of Arthur and Catherine’s marriage, was much later (and in a completely different political context) exploited by Henry and his court to cast doubt on the validity of Catherine’s union with Henry, eventually leading to the separation between the Church of England and the Roman Catholic Church. Source: Wikipedia]
Thus, another connection to Ludlow Castle (see pix I sent) first built under the auspices of an earlier ancestor, Sir William FitzOsbern, trusted lieutenant to William the Conqueror (see previous notes).
In the tombs at St Bartholomew’s Church, Tong (the family church owned by the Vernon family at the time) lie Sir Henry Vernon’s parents William Vernon III, wife Margaret Swynfen, Sir Richard Vernon VIII (Mary’s brother) and wife Lady Ann Talbot and a monument to Sir Thomas Stanley, husband of Mary’s sister Margaret. Ann Talbot was Lady-In-Waiting to Queen Jane Seymour. Google will reveal much more about this lot.
Such an intriguing time period. Randi’s family chimes in here too. Her first cousin 13 times removed was Sir Francis Bacon, whose family including Sir Francis himself (until his falling out), were highly influential in the politics of the day.
John. Please correct me if I’m wrong on any of this. Bill. Would you pass this on to David Flavell please.
Hope that helps, Peter
Fascinating, Peter.
I knew Ursula and John quite well. They stayed with us in Baie d’urfé more than once,(as did Laura). And Kåre, Hilary Louise and I spent a few days with ,them at their place in Blockley on our way home from a year in Norway.
John invited us to visit him in His place at All Souls in Oxford, where his title was a “Special Fellow”.
You have certainly had a marvellous trip, and this has been an excellent education to us all. Thank you both so much for passing on this information.
Lots of love,
Hilary
Peter I have no line of Fishers earlier than Reuben Fisher, surgeon of Southwark in the late 1600s. From that branch emerged the Quakers of Youghal, Cork, and Limerick in Ireland. Your statement that the Fishers married well is appropriate as Gabriel Fisher married Mary O’Callaghan a couple of generations later.
On another vein, I wonder if you were aware when you visited St Paul’s in London that you were in the stomping grounds of the first William Spriggs to live in London. The Parish of Nicholas Cole Abbey is just down from the cathedral as is Fish Street where he lived for a time. Any trace of the old houses in that area were wiped out in the blitz if not before.
Once a family connection is made to landed gentry it is much easier to trace the line earlier as those of importance kept good track of family to ensure that people knew who they were and what were the important family connections.
Ciao,
John
Hi John,
I went back to Reuben (1669-1723) on my tree to see how I linked to earlier Reuben Fisher Sr and beyond. No baptism records or proof of lineage so I must conclude I found the line on another’s tree. However, things seem to fit together. I’ll send you the link to the tree. Cheers, Peter